Quote from Brian Connelly on November 12, 2019, 10:09 am

I really feel like we will see 6-10 of our top 30 moved this offseason.

Some near certain, but don't know about this many... think more on roster "graduated prospects" may go as 'established' MLB'ers.

I realize MLB.com ranking not be-all, end-all but since only ranking available....

At the top, anywhere from 2-5 of Top 100 guys are/may be "Untouchable".   But look at 21-30:  Reggie Lawson #21 legit prospect may deserve top 20.  But after that it's 2 big Intl July signings not going anywhere, and mostly injured SP's:  Nix at #28 just went unclaimed, got outrighted.  Previous discussion about Avila/Espinoza possible DFA/trade to clear 40-man space to protect guys by 11/20, Mason Thompson potential but always hurt = zip trade value, Buddy Reed may go not protected OR selected in Rule 5.

Bottom line:   REALLY the prospect currency available to be dealt is around: #4/5 - #20

Quote from fenn68 on November 12, 2019, 10:17 am

The point on excess catchers is important and the Campusano v Torrens is valid.

Maybe that could be flipped and some teams who look at them that way see Torrens as the more valued player (or at least equal) with the added benefit of being a year closer to the ML (if not useful for 2020). Shade less risk therefore in Torrens.

Catchers ... if they are projected to be decent in the ML are maybe worth more due to the shortage of good catchers.

Given Mejia and Hedges are in the ML ... Allen deserves a ML run given his MiL hitting history ... and the aforementioned Torrens credentials .... and bundle that with the need for ML catching now ... maybe Preller’s first focus is to leverage out 2 of them in deals and hold on Campusano baring that blockbuster deal.

If the Padres really like any of their A ball prospects ... hard to trade them since few teams will give all that much to take on that projection risk ... so in a sense will sell low. Different if they are not convinced on the talent ... still would not get much but if it swings a deal not a big factor.

Quote from Brian Connelly on November 12, 2019, 10:25 am

Quote from fenn68 on November 12, 2019, 10:02 am

Agree that there are no elite pitchers that appear to be on the trade market and IF one appeared the bulk of current contenders would be swooping down to be in a deal ... jacking up the price ... maybe beyond reason. Sort of why paying up for a Cole or Strasburg has some legs and use all those better trade chips for OF ... assuming there are any good OF on the market that are not one year rentals.

Back to working to upgrade the OF since the current crop is more filler than all-star .. then from a prospect perspective Trammell (1-2 years out) then projecting any above average near term ML OF in the system is a more a wish that reality. Maybe Abrams if they convert him to the OF could take the fast track since he showed elite bat to ball skills and athletic ability but still earliest late 2021? Frankly looking for Top 100 types here like the Soto, Acura, Yelich .... which leads to

trading for an elite OF prospect (or at least Top 100)using current ML pieces (especially pitching) and prospects even if the prospect is a year out. Not to suggest foregoing trading / signing OF for the 2020 ML roster but in the shuffle of players needing to be moved off the 26 man to accommodate the new players might be able to benefit the future simultaneously. Need some multi-dimensional thinking here for both the now and for a couple of years down the road.

I realize the Pads just essentially did a prospect/s for prospect trade acquiring Trammell.  But they did that DURING 2019 as Sellers with no "mandate" to win that season.  Trammell is going to debut sometime in 2020.

They're NOT going to trade MLB pieces for an OF prospect who's 1 - 2 years away from 2020 if they are paying an elite SP in FA + Machado + Hosmer... at some point you have to "synchronize" into an MLB roster, not always be that 1 hot prospect coming in 3 years away... when other guys on your roster are too old and have to be replaced.  This is the ultimate challenge for a GM, and has for years been the flaw in the "build up the dominant farm system with massive investment" plan of Preller's:  The elite position players prospects are ahead of the elite SP prospects, and you can't expect even a truly elite SP like Gore to come in & be your #1 in his first 1-2 years in MLB.

Time to win is NOW.  BROWN!  2020!  78 yr old owner!  Mandate couldn't be more clear to Preller...

Fringe 40-man guys for lottery tickets?  Yes.  Significant MLB players for even high rated prospects?  No.  100% focus on improving MLB roster in 2020.

Quote from MrPadre19 on November 12, 2019, 11:10 am

So I guess I'm the only one who thinks that "four" years of Merrifield is worth Patino?

We need offense....we need a leadoff hitter....hell we could put him in CF if we keep Urias.

Would I rather have Kris Bryant?

Sure...but what do you think "he" is gonna cost in prospects?

I love Patino.....but you're not gonna get all star "major league" players by trading Owen Miller and Luis Torrens.

I said it before...I think some of you are gonna be really upset when you see some of these big name "prospects" traded away.

 

 

Quote from sportwarrior on November 12, 2019, 11:40 am

Quote from David Nevin on November 12, 2019, 11:10 am

So I guess I'm the only one who thinks that "four" years of Merrifield is worth Patino?

We need offense....we need a leadoff hitter....hell we could put him in CF if we keep Urias.

Would I rather have Kris Bryant?

Sure...but what do you think "he" is gonna cost in prospects?

I love Patino.....but you're not gonna get all star "major league" players by trading Owen Miller and Luis Torrens.

I said it before...I think some of you are gonna be really upset when you see some of these big name "prospects" traded away.

 

 

I mean, you obviously know this, but there's a huge difference between Patino and Torrens and a ton of names that fit between them. You can absolutely acquire great talent with players not named Patino.

Quote from MrPadre19 on November 12, 2019, 12:13 pm

Sure....but I'm also sure these teams aren't gonna give away 4 years of an all star either.

Maybe AJ draws a line....but if he doesn't add offense it's his head on the block.

 

 

 

Quote from Henry Silvestre on November 12, 2019, 1:02 pm

Also posted in Off-season thread.. but this fits here better....

 

Yeah I been kicking this around and say we got Price + Benintendi on a Myers + Lucchesi + Naylor + Arias + Morejon + Mejia type deal

Then followed with a Contreras for Hedges + Quantrill swap

followed by a Urias + Weathers + France + Ona for WHIT

With a final trade of Meadows for Patino + Margot + Edwards

Concluding with a FA signing of Hamels + Billy Hamilton + Stanmen

1B Hosmer 2B WHIT SS Tatis Jr 3B Machado C- CONTRERAS LF BENINTENDI CF MEADOWS RF Renfroe.....

BENCH - HAMILTON + Torrens/Allen + Garcia + Kinsler + Mejia-Bream (other)

SP - PRICE/Paddack/HAMELS/Richards/Lamet

BP- CL - Yates/ Stanmen/Munoz/Castillo/Baez/Bednar/Lauer/Strahm

Minors ready at some point in 2020-- Gore/Patino/Bolanos/Cantillo...... Miller/Trammell/Campusano/Ornelas... with yet another wave following led by CJ Abrams down the road

15 out.. 7 new faces in... a big roster turn over-- but only giving up 2 of our top 6 prospects and gaining big time pieces in return who are controlled for many seasons to come.. maybe not the ideal SP adds BUT 2 Veteran Gamers who will be lights out at Petco and above avg on the road.. how fast Gore takes to go from elite prospect to borderline ACE (like Paddack) will dictate how fast we could go from WC2 type wild entry to WS favorites (a la Houston).. But I think something along these lines is whats going to happen in 2020 offseason -- 7 new face in our 26.. and like 15 current faces or top 30 specs out--- sounds like a lot, but really feasible for this farm that would still boast Gore/Tramell/Campusano/CJ/ Manea/Head/Ornelas/Mears/Bolanos/etc.. etc...after all the moves

Quote from sportwarrior on November 12, 2019, 2:27 pm

Quote from David Nevin on November 12, 2019, 12:13 pm

Sure....but I'm also sure these teams aren't gonna give away 4 years of an all star either.

Maybe AJ draws a line....but if he doesn't add offense it's his head on the block.

 

 

 

Again, there's a big difference between "not including Patino" and "giving away nothing." Patino/Gore/Edwards are 3 names in a system pouring over with talent. Are you saying it's going to be absolutely necessary to part with one of those three to get anything of value? I don't disagree overall, but I do disagree it's necessary to part with Patino for Merrifield. If they say no, move on.

Quote from Henry Silvestre on November 12, 2019, 2:33 pm

Quote from sportwarrior on November 12, 2019, 2:27 pm

Quote from David Nevin on November 12, 2019, 12:13 pm

Sure....but I'm also sure these teams aren't gonna give away 4 years of an all star either.

Maybe AJ draws a line....but if he doesn't add offense it's his head on the block.

 

 

 

Again, there's a big difference between "not including Patino" and "giving away nothing." Patino/Gore/Edwards are 3 names in a system pouring over with talent. Are you saying it's going to be absolutely necessary to part with one of those three to get anything of value? I don't disagree overall, but I do disagree it's necessary to part with Patino for Merrifield. If they say no, move on.

For Meadows ? 100% I woild include both Patino + Edwards... (Gore is untouchable)...

For Whit I can go Weather's + Q + Urias + Ornelas or something like that... If WHIT (4yrs control) had the power game of say Lindor/Altuve to go along with the rest it would be a no-brainer to include Patino ..but he isn't so no Patino..i mean Urias closing line last 30-40 days of the season was very WHIT like minus the speed