Quote from fenn68 on October 30, 2019, 3:09 am

Looking at a Kluber trade from Cleveland’s perspective ... they barely missed the AL Central title and the Wild Card without Kluber and they are not in a strong financial position and trying to reduce payroll.

Being that close without Kluber ... not having strong competition (MINN has a very good chance of regressing) ... they would likely not be seeking prospects as much as ML pieces to take them back to the playoffs. Guessing they still have a 2 year window of contention until Lindor leaves and potentially the CWS’ prospect start to make them contenders.

Pitching without Kluber was not their problem ... OF was the big hole and with Puig (who really didn’t help Cleveland) gone to FA the OF remains their prime issue. So should expect the prime piece of a return for Kluber is a ML staring OF that is “low cost” and minimum of 2 years control.

Keeping in mind that moving a $17MM contract for a low cost return is part of the value to Cleveland and Kluber’s age plus poor start to 2019 before the injury should keep the actual players in any return limited. Buying team is taking on all the risk.

San Diego would probably have to start with either Renfroe or Margot (Cleveland could use either) .... then include a pitcher who could be useful starting or out of the pen now (Baez or Bolanos) ... then add France (with Kipnis gone to FA ... Ramirez goes to 2B leaving a hole at 3B. IF they were interested, Might add Allen as a potential back-up catcher option (they are OK with Perez). Probably would not do much more than that and clearly would not do any of the elite prospects. Actually, may not even need the throw-ins of France or Allen but if needed not much use to SD so OK.

Doubt any team will pay a ransom for Kluber at this stage of his career and the 2019 issues ... a pure risk deal. Maybe be better for Cleveland to hold on to Kluber and let him show he can return to form. Helps Cleveland win and can rebuild trade value if good ... if bad 2021 is a club option and it could just be declined.

Quote from BoosterSD on October 30, 2019, 7:26 am

So Fenn, would you be willing to do Renfroe, Margot, France, and Baez, to CLE for Kluber. Then you could leave Myers in LF, and then sign Akiyama for CF, and Gettys/Cordero platoon for RF?

 

Quote from fenn68 on October 30, 2019, 8:25 am

Quote from BoosterSD on October 30, 2019, 7:26 am

So Fenn, would you be willing to do Renfroe, Margot, France, and Baez, to CLE for Kluber. Then you could leave Myers in LF, and then sign Akiyama for CF, and Gettys/Cordero platoon for RF?

 

It is only one of the two Renfroe or Margot ... not both.

IF Renfroe: Myers - Margot / Cordero - Naylor with Jankowski in the wings plus still in the hunt for a further up grade via trade or FA ... especially if Jankowski is jettisoned

IF Margot: Myers - Cordero / Jankowski - Renfroe / Naylor plus still in the hunt for a further upgrade via trade or FA ... Akiyama by be more desirable in this scenario.

A bit of chicken and egg as to whether the Padres sign a FA OF or make a trade for an OF before they pursue a Kluber deal (e.g. sign Akiyama or Dickerson or trade for Marte). If they are not seeing their adds coming they (and I) probably would step back from dealing Renfroe or Margot and pass on Kluber.

I may not see either Renfroe or Margot as key piece for a competitive club ... but I am not ready to commit to their in-house replacements.

Since I am more concerned about improving the offense ... and consider Kluber a very big risk buy ... if I did pursue Kluber if it would be after securing OF upgrades (and may need a Renfroe or Margot to do that which would reduce the odd of meeting Cleveland’s needs).

A lot of potential moving parts ... Padres have a lot of needs and trade chips can only be used once ... so must consider all the options.

Quote from BoosterSD on October 30, 2019, 8:50 am

How do you see Gettys compared to Margot? That could be a key to how SD moves forward in the trade market for Margot? Gettys numbers in AAA (mind you AAA) where very good v. LHP. He had a .342 OBP v LHP, and had a scorching finish to AAA last season.

Quote from Randy Manese on October 30, 2019, 9:14 am

I believe he does and virtually taking a year off for an injury that wasn't an elbow or a shoulder probably will help him come back strong.  Another thing about Kluber is that there is a very reasonable team buy-option for both 2020 and 2021 on his current contract, should the worst case scenario happen and he drops from past elite status to non-starter.  Scherzer and Verlander are elite as well and I'm sure neither Houston or Washington is thinking of parting with them even though they are older than Kluber.

As for the potential cost, I absolutely loved the Urias I saw play two years ago but not so much the last two years when he changed his approach at the plate to try to be more like Altuve.  Padres are stacked in the middle infield with Miller, Edwards and others that could handle the job.   Moreover, if Urias fails again to live up to his potential this year, then his trade value will drop.  Morejon has immense talent but can't seem to stay on the field; he would be somebody that Cleveland can gamble on since they have other young pitchers and don't need him to start right away.  This would also be a trade now before his value possibly diminishes.  My thoughts on both these guys is that you have to move decent prospects to gain value and these moves won't diminish the strength of the minors, which is stacked with pitchers and middle infielders.

If you check out the effectiveness of Kluber over the past few years, you will see he was the equal to both Verlander and Scherzer.  Sure it is a risk, but I don't think a substantial risk.  Padres and Cleveland have been good trade partners in the past so I'm hoping this works out.  And I do like Mejia and Trammell and I believe we'll see both blossom at Petco in the next couple of years.

Quote from TatisJr on October 30, 2019, 9:37 am

I would love to acquire Kluber. It is a risk when you consider his age and he’s had some injuries over the years, but I think he has a couple good years left in him. I would be reluctant to part with Urias for him though. I haven’t given up on Urias yet and sending away a young talent like Urias for a 34 year old pitcher just seems too risky to me. I think Fenn is on the money with his proposal. The Indians would want Renfroe or Margot in a Kluber deal.
Now if Thor can be acquired using Urias I would definitely consider it. Maybe sign a vet like Sogard or Kipnis to fill the 2B void until one of the kids is ready to take over.

Quote from Henry Silvestre on October 30, 2019, 10:42 am

My ideal season with $$ of 150 or so for Padres

 

1. Sign Strasburg (5-0 tgis postseason best ever ) when we get there we minus well give ourselves the best cgance to succeed and not get Krenshawed.. Lol 5/150

2. Trade Myers + Weather's + Potts + Nix + Naylor to Baltinore for Trey Mancini.. (Spec value works for Orioles taking on all $$)

3. Sign Shogo (JPN) CF

4. Trade for Kubler (Lucchesi + Hedges + Renfroe + Margot )

5. Sign Puig in FA (.350 OBP ) kills RHP...

 

IF = Same ..OF Mancini/Shogo/Puig

C Mejia /Allen/ Torrens either Torrens or Allen in AAA

Bench France /Garcia / Franchy/C/ Kinsler??

SP Stras/Kubler/Paddack/Richards/ Lamet.. Lauer/Bolanos/ Baez/Strahm Starter role .S.Strahm also 7th inning dude..

Yates CL /Munoz/Castillo and ? Vet BP arm Stanmen or other..

That would be a nice 26..with a whole new OF with hi th OBP.. Very good SP lacking a lefty but Gore on the way and Lauer in long relief/Starter role so ok..

Quote from fenn68 on October 30, 2019, 11:16 am

It appears that the PITT situation is “flexible”. Last week they suggested they would not deal Marte ... now opening the door to a rebuild probably making Marte available.

I would make that a early pursuit by Preller ... 2 years at about $12MM per ... hits RHP and LHP ... can play effective defense at all three OF slots. IF PITT is rebuilding ... prospects would be the key and since they can move Reynolds to CF Margot does not have to part of the deal and they could go with a corner OF option with the prospects.

IF they can land Marte ... would give them some flexibility on signing either Akiyama (CF) or Dickerson (corner OF) ... that would significantly upgrade the offense with non-platoon players. Then the other corner is probably Myers making Renfroe, Margot, Naylor, Cordero in play for the right deal ... all are low cost and have control so at some level desirable adds to a deal ... but I would expect Preller to push to move Renfroe and Margot with more ML service and higher pay first.

Quote from 3fingersplit on October 30, 2019, 11:19 am

Quote from Henry Silvestre on October 30, 2019, 10:42 am

My ideal season with $$ of 150 or so for Padres

 

1. Sign Strasburg (5-0 tgis postseason best ever ) when we get there we minus well give ourselves the best cgance to succeed and not get Krenshawed.. Lol 5/150

2. Trade Myers + Weather's + Potts + Nix + Naylor to Baltinore for Trey Mancini.. (Spec value works for Orioles taking on all $$)

3. Sign Shogo (JPN) CF

4. Trade for Kubler (Lucchesi + Hedges + Renfroe + Margot )

5. Sign Puig in FA (.350 OBP ) kills RHP...

 

IF = Same ..OF Mancini/Shogo/Puig

C Mejia /Allen/ Torrens either Torrens or Allen in AAA

Bench France /Garcia / Franchy/C/ Kinsler??

SP Stras/Kubler/Paddack/Richards/ Lamet.. Lauer/Bolanos/ Baez/Strahm Starter role .S.Strahm also 7th inning dude..

Yates CL /Munoz/Castillo and ? Vet BP arm Stanmen or other..

That would be a nice 26..with a whole new OF with hi th OBP.. Very good SP lacking a lefty but Gore on the way and Lauer in long relief/Starter role so ok..

9 players for 2 ?

Plus 150 Mil

You need to get back on your meds and by the way.... Puig is an idiot...There is a reason the Dodgers and Reds got rid of him and if Cleveland is going to let him walk.....that tells me all I need to know about him. They need power hitting outfielders but I guess if you can't run out a ground ball when your team is trying to get the wild card spot and your own team mates talk with you and tell you that can't happen and you do it again.......Idiot comes to mind

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