Quote from Brian Connelly on February 20, 2020, 7:42 am

Quote from WindsorUK on February 20, 2020, 6:20 am

I'd be alright with Wil being here this year. As I've stated before, I agree with 3Finger that AG played a MAJOR role in Myer's struggles.

I guess we'll get a chance to find out this year ( as long as Tingler isn't drinking from the same fountain of stupidity)

It's a little beyond the pale to blame Myers' wild inconsistency, which has been the case for most of his time here, not just last year, just on AG.  Saying AG "fed him too much info" or whatever the various theories are is a little ridiculous... what was he supposed to do when Myers' was K 40% of the time?  Stand by & do nothing?  Keep starting him every day?

Preller & OK, AG too have NOT done Myers any favors by the constant positional & lineup movement in places where he's ill suited.... which could theoretically include LF.  But it was MYERS who went from an outstanding first year at 1B to not working to improve defensively at a freaking brand new position... and fell off a cliff to the point where Pads felt compelled to get Hos.

Myers at his best shows he can be the best player on the field & one of best in league, but he has NEVER been able to sustain that through a season, and his prolonged slumps are < MLB backup quality.

It's been 5 years, SD is a tough place to hit, and again Preller doing no favors with constant trade rumors circulating; how does he go into preseason/season with his "head in the right place"?

Quote from Henry Silvestre on February 20, 2020, 8:05 am

Quote from Brian Connelly on February 20, 2020, 7:42 am

Quote from WindsorUK on February 20, 2020, 6:20 am

I'd be alright with Wil being here this year. As I've stated before, I agree with 3Finger that AG played a MAJOR role in Myer's struggles.

I guess we'll get a chance to find out this year ( as long as Tingler isn't drinking from the same fountain of stupidity)

It's a little beyond the pale to blame Myers' wild inconsistency, which has been the case for most of his time here, not just last year, just on AG.  Saying AG "fed him too much info" or whatever the various theories are is a little ridiculous... what was he supposed to do when Myers' was K 40% of the time?  Stand by & do nothing?  Keep starting him every day?

Preller & OK, AG too have NOT done Myers any favors by the constant positional & lineup movement in places where he's ill suited.... which could theoretically include LF.  But it was MYERS who went from an outstanding first year at 1B to not working to improve defensively at a freaking brand new position... and fell off a cliff to the point where Pads felt compelled to get Hos.

Myers at his best shows he can be the best player on the field & one of best in league, but he has NEVER been able to sustain that through a season, and his prolonged slumps are < MLB backup quality.

It's been 5 years, SD is a tough place to hit, and again Preller doing no favors with constant trade rumors circulating; how does he go into preseason/season with his "head in the right place"?

Wil's personality and ADD also a big negative-- He strikes me as the type that is so gifted that he doesnt go the extra mile-- polar opposite of Pham-- Even Manny who has that reputation LOOKS terrific in ST dude must have been HULK like in the weight room.. looks pretty much 'Thick" in a good way... I dont know Wil personally but he strikes me as the type that gets a workout that requires 100 pushups-- and he does 100 pushups and callsit a day--- Nothing wrong with such a player if he delivers "consistent" results-- BUT big Warning sign when he doesnt... Again (Petco or not) 1.7WAR when he has Tatis Jr type Skills set... and the Rookie goes 4.2 WAR in 79 games-- is all I need to see... Not many are as gifted as Wil (Physically) but the mental/social/character makeup is just not good--- If Hosmer had Wil's physical gifts he would be the best player in the league --- Wil almost like a Cancer to the team in many ways-- doesnt engage with his teamates like Many/Hos/Tatisjr -- etc...

Quote from Brian Connelly on February 20, 2020, 8:05 am

It's very simple:  The Padres can not add Lindor or Bryant in the 17-18 MM salary range (& increase next year) without Myers being traded out...  if you don't like it, blame the Owners.

Senzel obviously they COULD add even if Myers still there... target for 2B?

But I think Padres DO have some leverage over Red Sox, who need SP desperately, hence Quantrill as the centerpiece.

Pads don't HAVE to trade Q with Myers.... they can explore the already growing as ST progresses (SP injuries) market for a high upside MLB experienced SP like he or Joey ALONE for prospect/s... which could be used as ammo now or in future for other trades.   Other teams need for SP should put upward pressure on the value of Q (or Joey)...

The same could be true with Pads  dealing a MLB caliber RP before the season starts.  As standalone alternatives, those are probably "better" for Pads to deal from strengths to simply get best possible (prospect) talent.... but they don't solve the underlying payroll limitation issue.  Even if the assets they acquire make it easier to turn around & make a major trade,  they would still be hemmed in by Myers' contract.

 

Quote from Henry Silvestre on February 20, 2020, 8:22 am

Quote from Brian Connelly on February 20, 2020, 8:05 am

It's very simple:  The Padres can not add Lindor or Bryant in the 17-18 MM salary range (& increase next year) without Myers being traded out...  if you don't like it, blame the Owners.

Senzel obviously they COULD add even if Myers still there... target for 2B?

But I think Padres DO have some leverage over Red Sox, who need SP desperately, hence Quantrill as the centerpiece.

Pads don't HAVE to trade Q with Myers.... they can explore the already growing as ST progresses (SP injuries) market for a high upside MLB experienced SP like he or Joey ALONE for prospect/s... which could be used as ammo now or in future for other trades.   Other teams need for SP should put upward pressure on the value of Q (or Joey)...

The same could be true with Pads  dealing a MLB caliber RP before the season starts.  As standalone alternatives, those are probably "better" for Pads to deal from strengths to simply get best possible (prospect) talent.... but they don't solve the underlying payroll limitation issue.  Even if the assets they acquire make it easier to turn around & make a major trade,  they would still be hemmed in by Myers' contract.

 

I see Perdomo + Guerra as a potential trade package for an upgrade elsewhere OR lower minors Lotto Tickets... Perdomo would make 28 + of the 26 man Rosters out there.. and is a valuable swingman... Guerra's upside as a BP arm is intriguing enough to other teams to carry him on their 26.. besides he can be the energency SS and a team carrying him wouldnt need a SS fill in elsewhere on their roster.. Don't think we have room (as currently constructed) to have both of this guys on the 26, and both too valuable around the league to be DFA'd

Quote from 3fingersplit on February 20, 2020, 11:22 am

Quote from Brian Connelly on February 20, 2020, 7:42 am

Quote from WindsorUK on February 20, 2020, 6:20 am

I'd be alright with Wil being here this year. As I've stated before, I agree with 3Finger that AG played a MAJOR role in Myer's struggles.

I guess we'll get a chance to find out this year ( as long as Tingler isn't drinking from the same fountain of stupidity)

" what was he supposed to do when Myers' was K 40% of the time?  Stand by & do nothing?  Keep starting him every day?"

LOL

You can't just cherry pick when it suits you........Everybody wants Cordero to have a spot in the OF....his K rate is over 40%

The only difference is that Cordero makes zip so I guess thats okay to strike out that much as long as he makes nothing.

Last thing.....1.6 war vs 2. whatever is a joke...WAR is a joke...it's is used by agents to garner more money for their client and if anybody really thinks that replacing anybody with somebody that has WAR advantage of 1 and trading multiple players to do it is is HIGH.

Just another fancy way to quantify a player and his skill set to get paid

Quote from TatisJr on February 20, 2020, 11:47 am

Quote from 3fingersplit on February 20, 2020, 11:22 am

Quote from Brian Connelly on February 20, 2020, 7:42 am

Quote from WindsorUK on February 20, 2020, 6:20 am

I'd be alright with Wil being here this year. As I've stated before, I agree with 3Finger that AG played a MAJOR role in Myer's struggles.

I guess we'll get a chance to find out this year ( as long as Tingler isn't drinking from the same fountain of stupidity)

" what was he supposed to do when Myers' was K 40% of the time?  Stand by & do nothing?  Keep starting him every day?"

LOL

You can't just cherry pick when it suits you........Everybody wants Cordero to have a spot in the OF....his K rate is over 40%

The only difference is that Cordero makes zip so I guess thats okay to strike out that much as long as he makes nothing.

Last thing.....1.6 war vs 2. whatever is a joke...WAR is a joke...it's is used by agents to garner more money for their client and if anybody really thinks that replacing anybody with somebody that has WAR advantage of 1 and trading multiple players to do it is is HIGH.

Just another fancy way to quantify a player and his skill set to get paid

3finger, I know using facts is difficult for you and you just prefer to go on rants, but you are dead wrong about WAR. It seems like you don’t like WAR because you don’t understand it. WAR was a stat created by Nate Silver’s Baseball Prospectus website to measure the cumulative worth of a player. WAR isn’t a perfect stat, but it has been adopted and used by every single FO in MLB. Agents actually HATE that saber metrics is used by FO to determine a players worth so you have that completely backwards.

Quote from onlypads on February 20, 2020, 12:52 pm

C'mon bro, no need to say "using facts is difficult for you." This is a fan forum, just relax. Yes 3finger can rant sometimes and be dismissive but all I know is I learn something from each and everyone of you on here.

And some of his and your points are valid. Stats express a metric. Obviously they do not determine the future and they are obviously limited as to the parameters of that metric. There are sound arguments regarding the applicability of WAR and the actual marginal gain associated with swaps of players having various associated WAR production.

Quote from Brian Connelly on February 20, 2020, 1:42 pm

Quote from 3fingersplit on February 20, 2020, 11:22 am

Quote from Brian Connelly on February 20, 2020, 7:42 am

Quote from WindsorUK on February 20, 2020, 6:20 am

I'd be alright with Wil being here this year. As I've stated before, I agree with 3Finger that AG played a MAJOR role in Myer's struggles.

I guess we'll get a chance to find out this year ( as long as Tingler isn't drinking from the same fountain of stupidity)

" what was he supposed to do when Myers' was K 40% of the time?  Stand by & do nothing?  Keep starting him every day?"

LOL

You can't just cherry pick when it suits you........Everybody wants Cordero to have a spot in the OF....his K rate is over 40%

The only difference is that Cordero makes zip so I guess thats okay to strike out that much as long as he makes nothing.

Last thing.....1.6 war vs 2. whatever is a joke...WAR is a joke...it's is used by agents to garner more money for their client and if anybody really thinks that replacing anybody with somebody that has WAR advantage of 1 and trading multiple players to do it is is HIGH.

Just another fancy way to quantify a player and his skill set to get paid

3, I agree with you to a degree that there is a "B.S." factor to WAR; I have definitely seen instances where guys' WAR high or low failed the common sense test.  That being said, why do guys like Mike Trout & Mookie Betts & Gerrit Cole have the highest WAR... b/c they are the best players!

But if I'm reading your post right, you're implying that I want Cordero as a starting OF in Myers' place?   NOT TRUE.  I've pounded the table that it's unrealistic to expect Cordero to start anywhere in MLB, b/c he's missed nearly 2 full years at ANY level with injuries...  But he HAS to play every day to develop.   So 1st choice would be to AAA to play 50/50 CF/RF.  But 2nd choice would be playing "every day" ('a lot') in MLB... worst outcome would be buried on MLB bench with no playing time.

Ummm...  yeah, everyone keeps quoting Cordero's high K rates in MLB... what 200 AB mostly 3 years ago?!   Yeah, if I'm a GM & I can pay a LH, faster, stronger-armed, 5 year younger guy who has ALREADY recorded some of the best exit velos in MLB and might actually improve/develop as a player... LITERALLY 40 times less to K about the same % of time as Myers... think I know what I'd do.

Quote from TatisJr on February 20, 2020, 4:56 pm

Quote from onlypads on February 20, 2020, 12:52 pm

C'mon bro, no need to say "using facts is difficult for you." This is a fan forum, just relax. Yes 3finger can rant sometimes and be dismissive but all I know is I learn something from each and everyone of you on here.

And some of his and your points are valid. Stats express a metric. Obviously they do not determine the future and they are obviously limited as to the parameters of that metric. There are sound arguments regarding the applicability of WAR and the actual marginal gain associated with swaps of players having various associated WAR production.

I know you’re fairly new to this forum, but 3finger has had this same rant about WAR for a very long time and he repeats it OFTEN. I have my own specific issues with WAR calculation and I’ve pointed them out on here before. He clearly doesn’t understand WAR so he just makes up this little story about agents creating the stat when the opposite is true. Agents hated when stats like WAR started getting used by FO. It just a fact. He always uses this rant to dismiss any poster who uses WAR when talking about a player. It’s gotten a little old. Sorry for pointing out that his rant was filled with BS.