Quote from 3fingersplit on March 5, 2022, 5:52 pm

People have a good idea where each side stands so on the major items.....where is the middle ground ?

Both sides need to give a bit so what will work for the players and owners ?

Quote from fenn68 on March 6, 2022, 4:45 am

Reports are that today the MLBPA will be submitting, in writing, their full counter offer covering all the issues. Owners currently have the last proposal (rejected by the union).

Apparently the union is now willing to go with a 14 team playoff scheme which was the owners’ initial position (union wanted 12) and previously the owners agreed to back down to 12. By the union being willing to go back up to 14 teams, that adds a major amount of new revenue into the negotiations and, hopefully, allows the owners to move off their positions on other issues ceding more money to the union positions.

Still sounds as though the key union issue is the CBT wanting a threshold around $240MM and less stringent penalties. Think the owners last were at $220MM. The other issue that could be in play is the pool of money for the top pre-arbitration players.

With a bigger pie (more revenue) … should be encouraged that the financial positions of both sides can be brought closer together.

Quote from 3fingersplit on March 6, 2022, 11:05 am

The CBT could be 300 million but the vast majority of teams will still run their budget.....maybe a few push the limit because they have the cash to pay any penalty

CBT....Owners at 220...players at 238 million......split the difference to a degree......227 million with a 7 million year increase for the duration of the new CBA....227,234,241,248,255 million.....owners have some wiggle room to increase payroll and players get a possible pay increase and based on projected revenue.....this is a no brainer....the owners DON"T have to spend it if they don't want to

Owners will still only spend what they have....e.g.......Pittsburgh....50-60 million dollar payroll

Quote from fenn68 on March 6, 2022, 12:00 pm

I guess both the MLBPA and the owners see the CBT impacting just enough teams to be contentious. Yes PITT, TB and the like are non-issues in this debate but only two teams last season LAD and SD exceeded the threshold. So it “appears” that the big money NYY, BOST, and a few others curbed their spending to just under the threshold.

The owners who want curb spending may see this lower CBT as working and, in theory, better for competitive balance. If a wealthy team chooses to not sign a quality player that player goes to another team making that team better … but without the big money teams participating the ultimate contract for that player becomes lower.

The union obviously wants the opposite effect and getting better contract for the top players … in their view … will pull up the salaries for the next level players.

Can’t definitively know the real impact … but if there appears to be enough teams on the bubble of spending more on speculation of contention but with limits depending on their risk evaluation.

I am in the “hard cap” / “hard floor” camp (thinking of the NFL who is pretty successful) BUT the NFL has a more uniform revenue distribution while MLB has some significant differences between the haves and have nots that make that likely unworkable. That approach would take money mostly out of the success / failure equation and focus on scouting, signing, developing, and managing talent. From what I can tell, the owners don’t want a hard floor and the union just does not want to get into any discussion that ties to a cap.

 

Quote from MrPadre19 on March 7, 2022, 5:39 am

To the fan it just seems like they could have say a "$100m Floor and a $250m Ceiling with gradual increases and everyone would be fine.

But it just doesn't work that way.

They could just use the amt of revenue sharing each team receives as a guide to raise or lower those numbers based on "their" reality.

Surely a Team worth $1b + with revenue coming in many avenues can afford $100m?

If nothing else the Padres just proved it's about "wanting" to spend...not about being "able" to spend.

 

Quote from 3fingersplit on March 7, 2022, 11:52 am

Well it looks like this is going to be a Loooooong drawn out standoff

The CBT is a major problem and both sides will not budge.....now they are about maybe games in June

I'm going fishing....wake me when it's over

Quote from MrPadre19 on March 7, 2022, 12:05 pm

Quote from 3fingersplit on March 7, 2022, 11:52 am

Well it looks like this is going to be a Loooooong drawn out standoff

The CBT is a major problem and both sides will not budge.....now they are about maybe games in June

I'm going fishing....wake me when it's over

Aren't they just $10-$20 mil apart?

Just meet in the damn middle and lets go!

Sheesh!

 

Quote from fenn68 on March 7, 2022, 12:08 pm

If I am the union, not relying on what teams “could” spend but focusing on what they are really spending … and the bottom tier clubs (for whatever their rationale) just are not spending on payroll. If teams will not pay voluntarily … need to force the issue. It works in the NFL.

A league minimum pay structure for rookies has been around for a long time … a league minimum for total payroll is a logical extension if players are going to get their piece of the BIG pie of revenue. Too many teams just will not spend and end up cutting veteran players for a rotation of league minimum types (cost over talent).

Having said that the small market owners will fight against it unless the big market clubs given them a bigger slice of the league revenue … and obviously the big market clubs want to keep the maximum they can. So, a no sale. Union also does not want the argue for a floor primarily because the know that comes with a call for a cap … something they absolutely don’t want. No sale.

Whatever … a floor is not in the cards.

Quote from BoosterSD on March 7, 2022, 1:23 pm

Quote from 3fingersplit on March 7, 2022, 11:52 am

Well it looks like this is going to be a Loooooong drawn out standoff

The CBT is a major problem and both sides will not budge.....now they are about maybe games in June

I'm going fishing....wake me when it's over

I agree, I've got some new clubs and the weather is getting warmer here in AZ. I can golf over worrying about ML Baseball easy!!