Quote from fenn68 on December 13, 2019, 1:44 pm

On the oft chance Preller does find a good trade and the selling team is not interested in a prospect that maybe a year or so away, would you prefer to deal Lucchesi or Quantrill?

Both are young, minimal cost, healthy, ML ready (although Lucchesi has more of a track record Quantrill maybe more upside) ... should have appeal to a team needing to fill out a SP staff.

Padres go with Paddack, Lamet, Davies, Richard, plus 1 (with a ton waiting in the wings).

Buyer’s choice if it is a good deal with either one?

Quote from Henry Silvestre on December 13, 2019, 2:26 pm

Quote from fenn68 on December 13, 2019, 1:35 pm

As I recall all the 2015 fireworks came AFTER the Winter Meetings ... so Santa is coming (hopefully not with a lump of coal).

Aside: I am OK if they stand pat (vs. moving a major prospect) since not all that sure any of the target names being tossed around move the needle to contending enough in 2020.

All we need is to beat the Brewers for WC2 .. Like the Nats ..w..we don't need to win the WEST..

Quote from Henry Silvestre on December 13, 2019, 2:32 pm

Quote from WindsorUK on December 13, 2019, 11:56 am

Quote from fenn68 on December 13, 2019, 6:12 am

My comment is not about what Preller has done so far ... which I like. It is about where he could go (and give up) if he really followed the win or get fired threat.

In 2015, I still believe he was pressured by Mike Dee (and in retrospect Fowler) to make big moves ... and yes they did not have a deep pool of prospects but they did pick up a lot of payroll that they had to eat later ... arguable could have been used more productively. Bottom line is that the deals for veterans were “sub-optimal”. Turner for Myers, Grandal / Erlin for Kemp, and Fried / Mallex Smith for Upton did not work out all that well. Padres kept on losing.

In 2019, if the same pressure exists from Fowler, he now has the talent to deal to “chase” (and overpay) for veteran names as short term fixes but this time actually hurt the future.

I do blame Fowler for this situation ... zero upside for the organization to publicly make the “heads will role” statement. But as I said, don’t really think Preller has that pressure on him and will stay the course ... can make the argument if he doesn’t make “big moves” and they lose ... he gets fired. If he makes “big moves” and they lose ... he get fired. If he makes “big moves” at the expense of the future and is just .500 for 2020 and then regresses ... he gets fired. If he makes no moves and preserves the top prospects ... they make .500 ... but the prospects fail in the future ... he gets fired.  The theme ... he will get fired at some point without sustained winning, so it is to his disadvantage to over reach for 2020.

How much better off would we be if Preller had made NONE of those trades?

Turner is an All Star caliber player, Fried a top of the rotation pitcher, Smith similar to Margot, Grandal All Star caliber.....

Whilst it was exciting at the time, looks bad in retrospect.

No Tatis ..No Paddack .. No Big $$ spending on J2 class.. No Castillo in the Pen... No Myers (lol) No Margot .. No Guerra ... No Mejia .. Likely no Hosmer (Aging Alonzo instead) ..no Naylor..  No Gore (cause we would be drafting in a different slot) No Abrams ..no no no.. No Thanks.. Tatis by himself will be greater than Turner + Fried combined

Quote from JasonE135 on December 13, 2019, 3:18 pm

Quote from fenn68 on December 13, 2019, 1:44 pm

On the oft chance Preller does find a good trade and the selling team is not interested in a prospect that maybe a year or so away, would you prefer to deal Lucchesi or Quantrill?

Both are young, minimal cost, healthy, ML ready (although Lucchesi has more of a track record Quantrill maybe more upside) ... should have appeal to a team needing to fill out a SP staff.

Padres go with Paddack, Lamet, Davies, Richard, plus 1 (with a ton waiting in the wings).

Buyer’s choice if it is a good deal with either one?

I am happy to stay with what we have and do no more trades as well fenn. I am sure that is why AJ is waiting instead of actively pursuing. Any trade now will be for a price that he is comfortable paying.

On your question, I would much rather keep Quantrill than Lucchesie. I really like him. I see him having the upside of an excellent #3 or even a quality #2. I can easily see him earning the #3 slot in our rotation right behind Gore and Paddack. That being said, I am sure he is the far more desirable trade chip as well. Lucchesie is absolutely more of a sure thing, but Quantrill has already shown the ability to dominate major league hitters like Lucchesie never has.

I am sure that every team has tried to demand Gore and Patino in trades. When they finally come down in price I am sure they will have their sights set on Quantrill, more so than Bolanos, Baez, Morejon and yes even Lucchesie.

Quote from MrPadre19 on December 13, 2019, 3:32 pm

I admit that Quantrill impressed me last season.

His velocity actually ticked up and he performed better than I thought he would.

But I like Joey too.

He has some tenacity to him that Q doesn’t seem to have and his motion has deception as well.

 

Quote from sportwarrior on December 13, 2019, 3:40 pm

Quantrill, I think, really flashed some great potential last year (before his ridiculously bad stretch of games to close out the season). I honestly prefer his potential to Lucchessi's reality. I like that kid, too, but he's now the player he's always going to be... Some strike outs, some decent starts, but mostly a 5ip pitcher who wastes way too many pitches by throwing balls that never, from the point of release till they (hopefully) hit the catcher's glove, have a chance at inducing a swing from the batter. He's a serviceable and at times exciting pitcher, but I don't think he's a championship pitcher.

Quote from Mike Turner on December 13, 2019, 3:53 pm

Quote from BoosterSD on December 13, 2019, 10:52 am

Mike, do you ever go to Chilis on Litchfield Rd or the Lazy Palms next to the Wigwam? If so, we need to meet up for a beverage and chat Padre baseball.

We don't typically go to Chili's except on rare occasions if friends are meeting up there.  We do go to Lazy Palms usually once per weekend or every other weekend.  Me and my wife used to live a few houses down from the owner of Lazy Palms.  We sold that house last year but just moved a few miles north in Litchfield Park.

Quote from TatisJr on December 13, 2019, 3:54 pm

Quote from Henry Silvestre on December 13, 2019, 2:32 pm

Quote from WindsorUK on December 13, 2019, 11:56 am

Quote from fenn68 on December 13, 2019, 6:12 am

My comment is not about what Preller has done so far ... which I like. It is about where he could go (and give up) if he really followed the win or get fired threat.

In 2015, I still believe he was pressured by Mike Dee (and in retrospect Fowler) to make big moves ... and yes they did not have a deep pool of prospects but they did pick up a lot of payroll that they had to eat later ... arguable could have been used more productively. Bottom line is that the deals for veterans were “sub-optimal”. Turner for Myers, Grandal / Erlin for Kemp, and Fried / Mallex Smith for Upton did not work out all that well. Padres kept on losing.

In 2019, if the same pressure exists from Fowler, he now has the talent to deal to “chase” (and overpay) for veteran names as short term fixes but this time actually hurt the future.

I do blame Fowler for this situation ... zero upside for the organization to publicly make the “heads will role” statement. But as I said, don’t really think Preller has that pressure on him and will stay the course ... can make the argument if he doesn’t make “big moves” and they lose ... he gets fired. If he makes “big moves” and they lose ... he get fired. If he makes “big moves” at the expense of the future and is just .500 for 2020 and then regresses ... he gets fired. If he makes no moves and preserves the top prospects ... they make .500 ... but the prospects fail in the future ... he gets fired.  The theme ... he will get fired at some point without sustained winning, so it is to his disadvantage to over reach for 2020.

How much better off would we be if Preller had made NONE of those trades?

Turner is an All Star caliber player, Fried a top of the rotation pitcher, Smith similar to Margot, Grandal All Star caliber.....

Whilst it was exciting at the time, looks bad in retrospect.

No Tatis ..No Paddack .. No Big $$ spending on J2 class.. No Castillo in the Pen... No Myers (lol) No Margot .. No Guerra ... No Mejia .. Likely no Hosmer (Aging Alonzo instead) ..no Naylor..  No Gore (cause we would be drafting in a different slot) No Abrams ..no no no.. No Thanks.. Tatis by himself will be greater than Turner + Fried combined

100 percent agree, Henry. You have to look at the totality of what Preller did in that 2015 reset. You can’t just pick out the prospects that panned out and not acknowledge the ones that didn’t pan out. You can’t look at the farm AJP inherited and dumped without acknowledging the supremely better farm he replaced it with. Let’s take the top 5 players AJP dealt away in 2015 for what he acquired using those pieces. So the trade would be Grandal, Turner, Fried, Eflin, J. Ross for Tatis Jr, Myers, Naylor, Margot, Logan Allen. I like the Tatis package more.

Quote from fenn68 on December 13, 2019, 4:11 pm

Preller “THE GOOD” ... trading overrated ML talent for outstanding prospect talent

Preller “THE BAD” ... trading for overrated ML talent

It is the Preller “THE BAD” that concerns me until I see better adds of ML talent.

I am getting way too old to enter another reset due to making short term moves that fail.