Quote from WindsorUK on September 15, 2022, 2:02 am

https://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/sports/padres/story/2022-09-14/padres-pregame-juan-soto-mariners-mike-clevinger-luis-castillo

This tells me Melvin is away with the fairies!

You can't drop Soto in the lineup because- he's Juan Soto?!?!?!

No one is suggesting drop him to 9 but certainly a good move is AT LEAST  swap he and Machado???

Has there been a less productive hitter in MLB, with as many AB's, since the deadline, as Juan Soto????

He 100% refuses to lift his bat off his shoulder....whilst batting 2. MOVE HIM or watch this season drain away as almost every one before it has....without playoffs.

 

Quote from Henry Silvestre on September 15, 2022, 8:21 am

Quote from fenn68 on September 12, 2022, 4:21 pm

Still trying to access Soto and his struggles.

Looked at 2021 and overall stat line was great and his RISP line was even better 396/577/689 (1.266 OPS) ... that is what Preller bought. Also note that almost all his PA were in the #3 slot and when he was in the #2 slot the results dropped in 2021.

This year (including WASH) he is at 180/354/315 (669 OPS). Appears his issue has started before coming to SD. In JUN his overall OPS as at .712 (.195 BA) but Jul back to 1.111 OPS (.315 BA) ... then on to SD and the abyss.

So, it appears that at some level Soto's struggles really started this year while still in WASH and has had a negative progression. On the optimistic side ... he came back for his June slump with a very strong July ... so some hope I guess.

Personally would move him to the #3 slot where he had been the most effective as a hitter in WASH. It is clearly not working at #2 slot ... he is going to play ... so why keep running him out at#2 to fail. If the analytics folks say your best hitter should be #2 ... at this moment in time is that not Machado?

 

Maybe go

Profar/Kim

Manny

Soto

Drury /Bell

Bell/Drury/Wil

Crone

Kim/Profar/Wil

Grish/Azocar/Wil

Nola/Alfaro/Campy

Try it .. see what happens

Quote from Henry Silvestre on September 15, 2022, 8:31 am

Quote from fenn68 on September 12, 2022, 4:21 pm

Still trying to access Soto and his struggles.

Looked at 2021 and overall stat line was great and his RISP line was even better 396/577/689 (1.266 OPS) ... that is what Preller bought. Also note that almost all his PA were in the #3 slot and when he was in the #2 slot the results dropped in 2021.

This year (including WASH) he is at 180/354/315 (669 OPS). Appears his issue has started before coming to SD. In JUN his overall OPS as at .712 (.195 BA) but Jul back to 1.111 OPS (.315 BA) ... then on to SD and the abyss.

So, it appears that at some level Soto's struggles really started this year while still in WASH and has had a negative progression. On the optimistic side ... he came back for his June slump with a very strong July ... so some hope I guess.

Personally would move him to the #3 slot where he had been the most effective as a hitter in WASH. It is clearly not working at #2 slot ... he is going to play ... so why keep running him out at#2 to fail. If the analytics folks say your best hitter should be #2 ... at this moment in time is that not Machado?

 

His August was very solid too ..just seems like it wasn't cause his Sept has been AWFUL

Aug

265

.435

.470

.905

Sept .409 OPS Oooooof

Quote from 3fingersplit on September 15, 2022, 8:54 am

I, for one, am so tired of all this analytics garbage.....our hitting coach was hired because he is some analytics guru but the problem is he doesn't know how to spot flaws in a swing or how to fix it and there are plenty of flaws to be fixed.....physical science , bio metrics come into play but just because a number cruncher says it should work doesn't mean it will and I have yet to see a algorithm in the HOF.

I have watched one player in particular that has changed at least 5 things in his swing from last the last couple years and the results have been disappointing and why ?

Baseball is still a "Eye" test game.....can't fix it if you don't know what you're looking for and are able to communicate it to players.

Quote from fenn68 on September 15, 2022, 9:50 am

Quote from 3fingersplit on September 15, 2022, 8:54 am

I, for one, am so tired of all this analytics garbage.....our hitting coach was hired because he is some analytics guru but the problem is he doesn't know how to spot flaws in a swing or how to fix it and there are plenty of flaws to be fixed.....physical science , bio metrics come into play but just because a number cruncher says it should work doesn't mean it will and I have yet to see a algorithm in the HOF.

I have watched one player in particular that has changed at least 5 things in his swing from last the last couple years and the results have been disappointing and why ?

Baseball is still a "Eye" test game.....can't fix it if you don't know what you're looking for and are able to communicate it to players.

Not really having seen Soto in WASH for those 3 years of elite hitting ... can't tell if his swing has changed. If it has that is one issue to work on. If it has not, might not want to tinker with the swing of a player all were hailing as the best in baseball and instead work to define what may be going on in his mental approach to AB and that could have him just making bad pitch selections.

Padres must have endless tape on Soto from the past three years ... so their R&D department should be able to see if the swing is different or his approach and pitch selection is different. First line of attack should be to get him to his WASH form. If they want productivity in 2022 that may be the best strategy ... introducing new changes takes time and it will be 2023 before they take (if they take). Only 20 games left in the season.

Whatever the reason, I am still on the kick of getting him out of the #2 slot since he is just not productive there ... good chance putting him there ahead of Manny altered his approach to trying to walk, taking more pitches than usual, and then on the defensive being behind in the count. He was a #3/#4 hitter in WASH and that entails a different approach. Maybe yes, maybe no ... but given his productivity should not the Padres at least entertain that could be part of the problem and change? For some reason, they are just stubborn on this.

Quote from fenn68 on September 15, 2022, 10:14 am

Quote from Henry Silvestre on September 15, 2022, 8:31 am

Quote from fenn68 on September 12, 2022, 4:21 pm

Still trying to access Soto and his struggles.

Looked at 2021 and overall stat line was great and his RISP line was even better 396/577/689 (1.266 OPS) ... that is what Preller bought. Also note that almost all his PA were in the #3 slot and when he was in the #2 slot the results dropped in 2021.

This year (including WASH) he is at 180/354/315 (669 OPS). Appears his issue has started before coming to SD. In JUN his overall OPS as at .712 (.195 BA) but Jul back to 1.111 OPS (.315 BA) ... then on to SD and the abyss.

So, it appears that at some level Soto's struggles really started this year while still in WASH and has had a negative progression. On the optimistic side ... he came back for his June slump with a very strong July ... so some hope I guess.

Personally would move him to the #3 slot where he had been the most effective as a hitter in WASH. It is clearly not working at #2 slot ... he is going to play ... so why keep running him out at#2 to fail. If the analytics folks say your best hitter should be #2 ... at this moment in time is that not Machado?

 

His August was very solid too ..just seems like it wasn't cause his Sept has been AWFUL

Aug

265

.435

.470

.905

Sept .409 OPS Oooooof

Soto is clearly going in the wrong direction ... and that goes against a number the folks that have been saying it takes some time to adjust. Six weeks is a long time to not be adjusted.

In Soto's case, I tend to discount an OBP built on walks. Padres got him for his .900+ OPS built on BA/SLG (which have not appeared). He SHOULD be an impact bat with extra base hits and driving in runs ... that is what they bought. In August only 6 RBI and only 1 RBI in September. He has had men on base ahead of him and either walks (good for his OBP) or makes an out.

As was suggested in an earlier post ... other teams have observed Soto is not being aggressive and instead seems to be wanting to walk ... they adjust and pound the plate putting behind in the count and on the defensive. Have noticed Soto trying to swing more at the first pitch ... so maybe he is trying to adjust.

Quote from Jeremy Hill on September 15, 2022, 11:00 am

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/juan-soto-isnt-having-a-juan-soto-year/

Quote from Henry Silvestre on September 15, 2022, 12:01 pm

236 .325 .368 .693 Manny's 1st 29 games as a Padres in 2019

209 .385 .330 .716 Soto 1st 34 games as a Padres ... with an injury to overcome to boot

Concerned? Or just par for the course?

Quote from fenn68 on September 15, 2022, 1:02 pm

Quote from Henry Silvestre on September 15, 2022, 12:01 pm

236 .325 .368 .693 Manny's 1st 29 games as a Padres in 2019

209 .385 .330 .716 Soto 1st 34 games as a Padres ... with an injury to overcome to boot

Concerned? Or just par for the course?

Concerned … of course … but looking at this from different perspective.

Padres paid premium for Soto for his production in the 2022 playoff run … and he is not producing at that premium level. Walking ahead of Machado is not enough to justify the price paid. Sure he may return to form in 2023-24 (good for him) but will the Padres even be contenders in those years?

Not sure why any team would pay premium at the trade deadline with the purpose of boosting their playoff run while it is “par for the course” to have that player struggle upon arrival in the new environment.

Maybe a case for adding “rentals” at the trade deadline … they will cost less in terms of prospects and likely just as productive as the multi-year pieces for the playoff push … and that is why the team is making the deal.